{"id":338055,"date":"2021-09-10T17:58:42","date_gmt":"2021-09-10T14:58:42","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/en.buradabiliyorum.com\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/"},"modified":"2021-09-10T17:58:42","modified_gmt":"2021-09-10T14:58:42","slug":"jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/","title":{"rendered":"#Jody Wilson-Raybould on Ottawa\u2019s power problem"},"content":{"rendered":"<div id=\"ez-toc-container\" class=\"ez-toc-v2_0_85 counter-hierarchy ez-toc-counter ez-toc-custom ez-toc-container-direction\">\n<p class=\"ez-toc-title\" style=\"cursor:inherit\">Table of Contents<\/p>\n<label for=\"ez-toc-cssicon-toggle-item-6a4127417bfc3\" class=\"ez-toc-cssicon-toggle-label\"><span class=\"\"><span class=\"eztoc-hide\" style=\"display:none;\">Toggle<\/span><span class=\"ez-toc-icon-toggle-span\"><svg style=\"fill: #dd3333;color:#dd3333\" xmlns=\"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg\" class=\"list-377408\" width=\"20px\" height=\"20px\" viewBox=\"0 0 24 24\" fill=\"none\"><path d=\"M6 6H4v2h2V6zm14 0H8v2h12V6zM4 11h2v2H4v-2zm16 0H8v2h12v-2zM4 16h2v2H4v-2zm16 0H8v2h12v-2z\" fill=\"currentColor\"><\/path><\/svg><svg style=\"fill: #dd3333;color:#dd3333\" class=\"arrow-unsorted-368013\" xmlns=\"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg\" width=\"10px\" height=\"10px\" viewBox=\"0 0 24 24\" version=\"1.2\" baseProfile=\"tiny\"><path d=\"M18.2 9.3l-6.2-6.3-6.2 6.3c-.2.2-.3.4-.3.7s.1.5.3.7c.2.2.4.3.7.3h11c.3 0 .5-.1.7-.3.2-.2.3-.5.3-.7s-.1-.5-.3-.7zM5.8 14.7l6.2 6.3 6.2-6.3c.2-.2.3-.5.3-.7s-.1-.5-.3-.7c-.2-.2-.4-.3-.7-.3h-11c-.3 0-.5.1-.7.3-.2.2-.3.5-.3.7s.1.5.3.7z\"\/><\/svg><\/span><\/span><\/label><input type=\"checkbox\"  id=\"ez-toc-cssicon-toggle-item-6a4127417bfc3\" checked aria-label=\"Toggle\" \/><nav><ul class='ez-toc-list ez-toc-list-level-1 ' ><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-1\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_How_have_you_been_doing_during_the_pandemic\" >Q: How have you been doing during the pandemic?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-2\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_Its_also_been_a_good_time_for_introspection_right_Can_you_walk_me_through_your_thought_process_as_you_decided_to_leave_Parliament\" >Q: It\u2019s also been a good time for introspection, right? Can you walk me through your thought process as you decided to leave Parliament?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-3\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_I_mean_Im_all_about_that\" >Q: I mean, I\u2019m all about that.<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-4\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_Your_resignation_statement_called_the_House_of_Commons_increasingly_%E2%80%9Ctoxic_and_ineffective%E2%80%9D_and_warned_of_a_%E2%80%9Cdisgraceful_triumph_of_harmful_partisanship_over_substantive_action%E2%80%9D_under_current_political_leadership_You_also_spoke_to_the_reckoning_that_Canadas_having_over_its_colonial_legacy_and_systemic_biases_It_was_reminiscent_of_some_of_the_things_NDP_MP_Mumilaaq_Qaqqaq_said_in_her_own_resignation_speech_Based_on_your_experiences_operating_within_these_systems_do_you_think_theyre_salvageable\" >Q: Your resignation statement called the House of Commons increasingly \u201ctoxic and ineffective,\u201d and warned of a \u201cdisgraceful triumph of harmful partisanship over substantive action\u201d under current political leadership. You also spoke to the reckoning that Canada\u2019s having over its colonial legacy and systemic biases. It was reminiscent of some of the things NDP MP Mumilaaq Qaqqaq said in her own resignation speech. Based on your experiences operating within these systems, do you think they\u2019re salvageable?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-5\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_A_lot_of_other_people_would_say_no_you_have_to_burn_it_to_the_ground\" >Q: A lot of other people would say no, you have to burn it to the ground.<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-6\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_So_what_changes_do_you_want_to_see_What_are_some_concrete_ways_to_reconstruct_as_you_put_it\" >Q: So what changes do you want to see? What are some concrete ways to reconstruct, as you put it?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-7\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_You_mean_our_first-past-the-post_electoral_system\" >Q: You mean our first-past-the-post electoral system?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-8\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_When_you_first_ran_in_2015_were_you_hopeful_that_the_Liberal_partys_%E2%80%9Creal_change%E2%80%9D_narrative_was_genuine_Or_did_you_already_go_into_it_with_some_cynicism_thinking_%E2%80%9COkay_its_going_to_be_hard_to_move_past_the_superficial_partisan_stuff%E2%80%9D\" >Q: When you first ran in 2015, were you hopeful that the Liberal party\u2019s \u201creal change\u201d narrative was genuine? Or did you already go into it with some cynicism, thinking, \u201cOkay, it\u2019s going to be hard to move past the superficial partisan stuff\u201d?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-9\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_Can_you_imagine_wanting_to_be_an_elected_official_for_that_long\" >Q: Can you imagine wanting to be an elected official for that long?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-10\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_But_in_that_environment_it_takes_a_special_kind_of_person\" >Q: But in that environment, it takes a special kind of person.<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-11\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_That_blind_loyalty_you_talked_about_seems_to_be_very_much_the_norm_But_how_would_you_get_rid_of_that\" >Q: That blind loyalty you talked about seems to be very much the norm. But how would you get rid of that?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-12\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_What_are_the_merits_of_trying_to_change_the_political_system_from_within\" >Q: What are the merits of trying to change the political system from within?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-13\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_You_were_bucking_up_against_that_status_quo_while_you_were_in_cabinet_and_its_I_think_what_ultimately_led_to_your_departure_But_the_status_quo_seems_to_have_held_on_Is_that_demoralizing\" >Q: You were bucking up against that status quo while you were in cabinet, and it\u2019s, I think, what ultimately led to your departure. But the status quo seems to have held on. Is that demoralizing?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-14\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_You_wouldnt_discourage_a_young_Indigenous_person_from_running_for_politics_It_sounds_like_youd_encourage_them_to_go_for_it\" >Q: You wouldn\u2019t discourage a young Indigenous person from running for politics. It sounds like you\u2019d encourage them to go for it.<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-15\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_I_was_speaking_with_a_current_cabinet_minister_who_described_your_departure_from_the_Liberal_party_as_losing_a_member_of_their_family\" >Q: I was speaking with a current cabinet minister who described your departure from the Liberal party as losing a member of their family.<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-16\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_If_the_Prime_Minister_had_asked_you_to_stay_would_you_have_considered_it\" >Q: If the Prime Minister had asked you to stay, would you have considered it?<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-17\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_Tell_me_a_bit_more_about_being_independent_I_could_imagine_that_it_would_be_harder_to_feel_like_youre_leaving_your_stamp_on_things_when_youre_on_your_own_but_on_the_other_hand_youre_free_of_that_partisan_structure\" >Q: Tell me a bit more about being independent. I could imagine that it would be harder to feel like you\u2019re leaving your stamp on things when you\u2019re on your own, but on the other hand you\u2019re free of that partisan structure.<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-4'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-18\" href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/jody-wilson-raybould-on-ottawas-power-problem\/#Q_Whats_next_for_you\" >Q: What\u2019s next for you?<\/a><\/li><\/ul><\/nav><\/div>\n<p>&#8220;<strong>#Jody Wilson-Raybould on Ottawa\u2019s power problem<\/strong>&#8221;<\/p>\n<div>\n                I spoke with Jody Wilson-\u00adRaybould shortly before the release of her political memoir, <em>\u201cIndian\u201d in the Cabinet<\/em>. The political memoir, published by Harper Collins, is an account of Wilson-Raybould\u2019s time in federal politics that focuses on her experiences working in Prime Minister Justin Trudeau\u2019s first cabinet. The former minister of justice and attorney <a href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/category\/general\/\" data-internallinksmanager029f6b8e52c=\"3\" title=\"General\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">general<\/a> was ousted from the Liberal party in 2019, having resigned from cabinet over Trudeau\u2019s perceived interference in a criminal prosecution of SNC-Lavalin. Our conversation was edited for length and clarity.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_How_have_you_been_doing_during_the_pandemic\"><\/span>Q: How have you been doing during the pandemic?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>Faring pretty well. God, I remember having questions like this 18 months ago. Having to transition to a hybrid Parliament was a fascinating experience. It\u2019s made everybody very familiar with Zoom. But I\u2019ve missed the hands-on, in-person meetings and doing stuff in the community.<\/p>\n<p>I don\u2019t know about you, but I started baking. Then I realized the only thing I can do is get outside. I started walking. And now I\u2019m a runner.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_Its_also_been_a_good_time_for_introspection_right_Can_you_walk_me_through_your_thought_process_as_you_decided_to_leave_Parliament\"><\/span>Q: It\u2019s also been a good time for introspection, right? Can you walk me through your thought process as you decided to leave Parliament?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:<\/strong> When we went into that hybrid Parliament reality, there were some important initiatives that the government moved on to support Canadians through an unprecedented time. It showed me that we can do big things if we actually co-operate.<\/p>\n<p>But that co-operation was short-lived. I witnessed a return to, even more so, this hyper-partisan jockeying for position in terms of acquiring votes and political expediency over the major issues that needed to be discussed. Climate change, Indigenous reconciliation, <a href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/category\/social-mediaa\/\" data-internallinksmanager029f6b8e52c=\"1\" title=\"Social Media\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">social<\/a> justice: the ones that brought me into politics.<\/p>\n<p>I\u2019ve always been a copious note-taker, and I write in journals. I started to write different vignettes of experiences that I had in elected leadership, as a minister, as an MP. That was how the book was formed. I was thinking about\u2014this is highfalutin, I guess\u2014the nature of democracy.<\/p>\n<blockquote><p><strong>RELATED:\u00a0Murray Sinclair on reconciliation, anger, unmarked graves\u2014and a headline for this story<\/strong><\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_I_mean_Im_all_about_that\"><\/span>Q: I mean, I\u2019m all about that.<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:<\/strong> I was thinking about all the different elected roles that I had and why I got into them in the first place. Was I able to accomplish what I wanted to accomplish?<\/p>\n<p>So at some point along that path, I decided that I need to leave politics for now. I\u2019m h<a href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/category\/download-scripts-themes-apps\/\" data-internallinksmanager029f6b8e52c=\"9\" title=\"Download Scripts &amp; Themes &amp; Apps\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">app<\/a>y with my decision. It was a hard one, and there were a lot of emotions around it. The lost opportunity, particularly. And that it didn\u2019t have to be this way.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_Your_resignation_statement_called_the_House_of_Commons_increasingly_%E2%80%9Ctoxic_and_ineffective%E2%80%9D_and_warned_of_a_%E2%80%9Cdisgraceful_triumph_of_harmful_partisanship_over_substantive_action%E2%80%9D_under_current_political_leadership_You_also_spoke_to_the_reckoning_that_Canadas_having_over_its_colonial_legacy_and_systemic_biases_It_was_reminiscent_of_some_of_the_things_NDP_MP_Mumilaaq_Qaqqaq_said_in_her_own_resignation_speech_Based_on_your_experiences_operating_within_these_systems_do_you_think_theyre_salvageable\"><\/span>Q: Your resignation statement called the House of Commons increasingly \u201ctoxic and ineffective,\u201d and warned of a \u201cdisgraceful triumph of harmful partisanship over substantive action\u201d under current political leadership. You also spoke to the reckoning that Canada\u2019s having over its colonial legacy and systemic biases. It was reminiscent of some of the things NDP MP Mumilaaq Qaqqaq said in her own resignation speech. Based on your experiences operating within these systems, do you think they\u2019re salvageable?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:<\/strong> I do think they\u2019re salvageable. I have to believe that. We live in one of the most wonderful countries in the world in spite of our history and what has happened and what\u2019s gone wrong. But we have to work on our democracy. We have to work on our institutions. We have to be constantly vigilant, and I think we need to be honest with ourselves about the nature of the democracy that we live in to ensure that we don\u2019t go down unhealthy paths of polarization that we see to a great degree south of the border.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_A_lot_of_other_people_would_say_no_you_have_to_burn_it_to_the_ground\"><\/span>Q: A lot of other people would say no, you have to burn it to the ground.<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:<\/strong> There\u2019s a certain element of truth to that. I think that having a very close look and deconstructing our realities and understanding the nature of our institutions, looking at our colonial reality right now, requires us to take things down to the studs.<\/p>\n<p>Parliament and the colonial laws that still exist in the books, racist laws, these things all have to be confronted. We need to ensure as Canadians that we tell our so-called leaders, and people that want to run for office and be elected, that the status quo on Indigenous reconciliation, on racial justice and on climate change is not good enough. We have to actually do something and create space for rebuilding those institutions where there is systemic racism and bias.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_So_what_changes_do_you_want_to_see_What_are_some_concrete_ways_to_reconstruct_as_you_put_it\"><\/span>Q: So what changes do you want to see? What are some concrete ways to reconstruct, as you put it?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>When I ran in 2019, even before that, I talked about looking at the way Parliament operates: the way the standing orders are written, the power and the privileges ascribed to political parties and the nature of our election system.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_You_mean_our_first-past-the-post_electoral_system\"><\/span>Q: You mean our first-past-the-post electoral system?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>Exactly. Look at what\u2019s happening in New Zealand or other countries that have some model of proportional representation. In my experience, the power that is put in the Prime Minister and the Prime Minister\u2019s Office\u2014and by virtue of that, unelected, unaccountable people\u2014in terms of how we make laws and policies in this country definitely needs to be revisited.<\/p>\n<p>In our system, there can be wrongdoing, and unless there\u2019s a public outcry around wrongdoing, days pass. If there are nefarious actors, it can be hugely problematic. So looking at the nature of government, the power that\u2019s put in the Prime Minister, in the cabinet, the nature of confidences that there are, we need to look at those things.<\/p>\n<p>And I would love to see a leader who truly believes that when you bring together people from diverse backgrounds into a political party, it\u2019s not just to tick off boxes to say that they\u2019re woke in an election. I understand there was a measure of tokenism in my becoming a candidate in 2015. I get that. But if you truly believe \u201cdiversity is our strength,\u201d then you embrace the diversity and you create the space for truth to be spoken.<\/p>\n<div class=\"longform-fwimg-container\"><img decoding=\"async\" data-sizes=\"auto\" src=\"https:\/\/www.macleans.ca\/wp-content\/uploads\/2021\/08\/JODY-WILSON-RAYBOULD-SMITH-AUG29-01.jpg\" alt=\"Former justice minister Wilson-Raybould (Photograph by Blair Gable; Hair and makeup by Marianne Moore\/One Fine Beauty)\"\/><\/p>\n<p class=\"wp-caption-text\">(Photograph by Blair Gable; Hair and makeup by Marianne Moore\/One Fine Beauty)<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_When_you_first_ran_in_2015_were_you_hopeful_that_the_Liberal_partys_%E2%80%9Creal_change%E2%80%9D_narrative_was_genuine_Or_did_you_already_go_into_it_with_some_cynicism_thinking_%E2%80%9COkay_its_going_to_be_hard_to_move_past_the_superficial_partisan_stuff%E2%80%9D\"><\/span>Q: When you first ran in 2015, were you hopeful that the Liberal party\u2019s \u201creal change\u201d narrative was genuine? Or did you already go into it with some cynicism, thinking, \u201cOkay, it\u2019s going to be hard to move past the superficial partisan stuff\u201d?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>I\u2019d been around politics and politicians. But I have a very different world view, and I come from the Indigenous political world where there are no political parties. So then understanding that idea that, in terms of where good ideas come from, if they\u2019re not from within your party, then it\u2019s bad? I\u2019d never experienced that before. I obviously was aware of parties and partisanship. But the depth of it, the hyper-partisanship and particularly the blind loyalty that I witnessed among so many MPs was very disconcerting, to say the least. And I continue to be surprised, even talking with different media people or politicians who have been around for decades.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_Can_you_imagine_wanting_to_be_an_elected_official_for_that_long\"><\/span>Q: Can you imagine wanting to be an elected official for that long?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>No, I can\u2019t. Like, if I was continuing to do something every year toward my goals and trying to create outcomes, yeah, sure, but . . .<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_But_in_that_environment_it_takes_a_special_kind_of_person\"><\/span>Q: But in that environment, it takes a special kind of person.<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>It really does and, you know, I would never be a career politician. I believe it\u2019s a means to an end.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_That_blind_loyalty_you_talked_about_seems_to_be_very_much_the_norm_But_how_would_you_get_rid_of_that\"><\/span>Q: That blind loyalty you talked about seems to be very much the norm. But how would you get rid of that?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>It requires leadership from the very top, which is what I saw back in 2015. When I had that initial conversation with the now Prime Minister and so many other people, I truly believed that politics can be done differently. I was hopeful and optimistic.<\/p>\n<p>In my first year or so of being a cabinet minister, there was more freedom and we were able to get a huge amount of things done, which I\u2019m really proud of. But over time, elections start looming and priorities change. We\u2019re constantly having to poll everything and making decisions based on polls. That\u2019s problematic.<\/p>\n<p>But it takes leadership, and I\u2019m still waiting to see this leader. I thought it was the current Prime Minister. Canadians are starved for politicians with integrity, politicians who tell them the truth.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_What_are_the_merits_of_trying_to_change_the_political_system_from_within\"><\/span>Q: What are the merits of trying to change the political system from within?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>I think it\u2019s important to have people working within a system, and I think it\u2019s important to have people working outside of the system. I was there at seemingly the highest level of government as an Indigenous person. That was important. And I found it doesn\u2019t matter what table you sit around, with what level of perceived power and influence. Your voice can be marginalized.<\/p>\n<p>I found that the status quo is very strong. So it also gets to a place where people within a system become creatures of that system. So having people on the outside looking in that have experience with how government works, with the nature of how decisions are made, with the toxicity of partisanship, I think is important. In terms of not just being negative and calling things out but to actually pragmatically work hard to address the challenges that we have.<\/p>\n<div id=\"attachment_1224789\" style=\"width: 830px\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" data-sizes=\"auto\" class=\"wp-image-1224789 lazyload\" src=\"https:\/\/www.macleans.ca\/wp-content\/uploads\/2021\/08\/JODY-WILSON-RAYBOULD-SMITH-AUG29-02.jpg\" alt=\"Wilson-Raybould gives testimony about the SNC-LAVALIN affair before a justice committee hearing in February 2019 (Lars Hagberg\/AFP\/Getty Images)\" width=\"820\" height=\"547\"\/><\/p>\n<p class=\"wp-caption-text\">Wilson-Raybould gives testimony about the SNC-LAVALIN affair before a justice committee hearing in February 2019 (Lars Hagberg\/AFP\/Getty Images)<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_You_were_bucking_up_against_that_status_quo_while_you_were_in_cabinet_and_its_I_think_what_ultimately_led_to_your_departure_But_the_status_quo_seems_to_have_held_on_Is_that_demoralizing\"><\/span>Q: You were bucking up against that status quo while you were in cabinet, and it\u2019s, I think, what ultimately led to your departure. But the status quo seems to have held on. Is that demoralizing?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>Well, yeah, I absolutely did try. As so many others have tried and continue to try. I consider myself in the latter category, still continuing to try.<\/p>\n<p>I wouldn\u2019t change my experience. As my grandmother taught me, I always make sure I can look myself in the mirror at night knowing that I\u2019ve done everything I can and held true to who I am. I\u2019m gonna continue to do that. I hope that people are not dissuaded from getting involved based on what they saw of my experience.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_You_wouldnt_discourage_a_young_Indigenous_person_from_running_for_politics_It_sounds_like_youd_encourage_them_to_go_for_it\"><\/span>Q: You wouldn\u2019t discourage a young Indigenous person from running for politics. It sounds like you\u2019d encourage them to go for it.<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>Oh my god yeah, absolutely. I would be cheering them on for sure. No matter what party they run for.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_I_was_speaking_with_a_current_cabinet_minister_who_described_your_departure_from_the_Liberal_party_as_losing_a_member_of_their_family\"><\/span>Q: I was speaking with a current cabinet minister who described your departure from the Liberal party as losing a member of their family.<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>[Laughs] I have a family, and I truly value my family, and as much as we don\u2019t want certain family members at certain times we cannot ever get rid of our family members. So what that minister is articulating I don\u2019t understand at all.<\/p>\n<p>I mean, dating back to when I was kicked out, Jane [Philpott] and I were kicked out by the Prime Minister, unlawfully, I might add. That was his choice. I haven\u2019t changed who I am. My values and my beliefs haven\u2019t changed. If anything, they\u2019ve been reinforced.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_If_the_Prime_Minister_had_asked_you_to_stay_would_you_have_considered_it\"><\/span>Q: If the Prime Minister had asked you to stay, would you have considered it?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>That\u2019s a good question. I\u2019ve thought about it. I do not believe based on everything that happened to me and the actions that the Prime Minister and other people around him took, whether that be through SNC or other issues that happened throughout my time in government, I don\u2019t believe that I could\u2019ve run under this Prime Minister in 2019. I\u2019m not going to say he did me a favour, but I loved running in both federal elections. I loved, so much, 2019 and running as an independent.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_Tell_me_a_bit_more_about_being_independent_I_could_imagine_that_it_would_be_harder_to_feel_like_youre_leaving_your_stamp_on_things_when_youre_on_your_own_but_on_the_other_hand_youre_free_of_that_partisan_structure\"><\/span>Q: Tell me a bit more about being independent. I could imagine that it would be harder to feel like you\u2019re leaving your stamp on things when you\u2019re on your own, but on the other hand you\u2019re free of that partisan structure.<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>I wish there were more independently minded people right across the board and that independent thinking was encouraged again. We need leadership.<\/p>\n<p>Being an independent in Parliament can be lonely. I am in a caucus of one. But what I found with the exception of the governing party is MPs were so open, so helpful, offering me time in debate in the House, offering me questions, offering me places at committee to participate if I wished, so there was that congeniality, which I really appreciated.<\/p>\n<h4><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Q_Whats_next_for_you\"><\/span>Q: What\u2019s next for you?<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h4>\n<p><strong>A:\u00a0<\/strong>I\u2019m looking forward to the book coming out. Hopefully it creates discussion around what I think have been really important themes in our politics right now and for our country.<\/p>\n<p>Before federal politics, I worked with my husband and many other people on a governance toolkit for Indigenous nations. I want to update that. But I haven\u2019t made any definitive decisions. I\u2019ve been fortunate to have lots of different offers around politics and different political positions, so I\u2019m just gonna think about the opportunities I have and where I can be the most useful and advance the issues I\u2019ve been advocating for for decades now.<br \/>\n<span class=\"ctx-article-root\"><!-- --><\/span>\n                            <\/div>\n<p><script async defer crossorigin=\"anonymous\" src=\"https:\/\/connect.facebook.net\/en_US\/sdk.js\"><\/script><\/p>\n<blockquote><p><strong><span style=\"color: #ff6600;\">If you liked the article, do not forget to share it with your friends. Follow us on\u00a0<span style=\"color: #ff0000;\"><a style=\"color: #ff0000;\" href=\"https:\/\/news.google.com\/publications\/CAAqBwgKMLG0nwswvr63Aw\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow noopener noreferrer\">Google News<\/a><\/span>\u00a0too, click on the star and choose us from your favorites.<\/span><\/strong><\/p><\/blockquote>\n<blockquote>\n<p style=\"text-align: center;\">For forums sites go to <span style=\"color: #ff9900;\"><a style=\"color: #ff9900;\" href=\"https:\/\/forum.buradabiliyorum.com\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Forum.BuradaBiliyorum.Com<\/a><\/span><\/strong>\n<\/p><\/blockquote>\n<blockquote>\n<p style=\"text-align: center;\"><strong>If you want to read more <a href=\"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/category\/news\/\" data-internallinksmanager029f6b8e52c=\"2\" title=\"News\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">News<\/a> articles, you can visit our <span style=\"color: #ff9900;\"><a style=\"color: #ff9900;\" href=\"https:\/\/en.buradabiliyorum.com\/general\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">General category.<\/a><\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p><span style=\"color: black;\"><a style=\"color: #ff9900;\" href=\"https:\/\/www.macleans.ca\/longforms\/jody-wilson-raybould-interview\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">Source<\/a><\/span><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>&#8220;#Jody Wilson-Raybould on Ottawa\u2019s power problem&#8221; I spoke with Jody Wilson-\u00adRaybould shortly before the release of her political memoir, \u201cIndian\u201d in the Cabinet. The political memoir, published by Harper Collins, is an account of Wilson-Raybould\u2019s time in federal politics that focuses on her experiences working in Prime Minister Justin Trudeau\u2019s first cabinet. The former minister&#8230;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":338056,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"fifu_image_url":"https:\/\/www.macleans.ca\/wp-content\/uploads\/2021\/08\/JODY-WILSON-RAYBOULD-SMITH-AUG31c-766x431.jpg","fifu_image_alt":"","footnotes":""},"categories":[1],"tags":[67806,87019],"class_list":["post-338055","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-general","tag-editors-picks","tag-jody-wilson-raybould"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/338055","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=338055"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/338055\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/338056"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=338055"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=338055"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/buradabiliyorum.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=338055"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}